Start your subscription today and save up to 70%. Roofing nails are OK but certainly have a lot less holding power, and deck screws don't have big enough heads. Ready to get the tools and materials you need? I need to install 1/4 Hardibacker over 3/4 Advantech. By the DIY experts of The Family Handyman Magazine. Place the first sheet over the mortar bed. Joists are 2x10 and 16". The extra mortar will make it easier to embed the. Mix a small batchof thin-setmortar as directed by the manufacturer, mixing the dry powder with water in a bucket. Thats the main reason theyre a go-to choice for permanent installations like this. It would help with bonding the thinset to the ply. Come join the discussion about the industry, trades, safety, projects, finishing, tools, machinery, styles, scales, reviews, accessories, classifieds, and more! Thanks for contributing an answer to Home Improvement Stack Exchange! I am working on a project and hope I didn't screw things up. Also, will this cause problems down the road, and should I continue pushing the issue? Also since this is Advantech flooring, if I must use mortar will it adhere well to Advantech? By clicking Post Your Answer, you agree to our terms of service, privacy policy and cookie policy. If thats the case, unfortunately, theres no quick fix for this problem other than removing the tile and cement backer board and starting over. thanx for the info! Score the cement board deeply with two or three passes with the knife, using the square to ensure a straight line, then snap the waste area of the sheet back to break the board along the cutting line. @isherwood I agree but the only argument I have for them doing more work is the requirements specified by the manufacturer. Get an overview of the process of creating a traditional-style fireplace that burns well and meets current building codes from experienced mason Mike Mehaffey. ." I thought it was a Star Wars spin-off at first. Local store prices may vary from those displayed. I know I should have staggered the boards when installing (first mistake), but just now realized I also didn't use the latex polymer additive for the thinset between the cement boards and plywood (second BIG mistake). what you have will work for both the hardie and tile. Products shown as available are normally stocked but inventory levels cannot be guaranteed, For screen reader problems with this website, please call 1-800-430-3376 or text 38698 (standard carrier rates apply to texts), #6 x 1-1/4 in. The offers that appear in this table are from partnerships from which The Spruce receives compensation. MAPEI recommends the use of MAPEI Porcelain Tile Mortar, MAPEI Large-Format Floor & Wall Tile Mortar or MAPEI Large Tile & Stone Mortar as thin-set under the cement board. How to prove that both people know the same dictionary word? The guide referenced above seems to be more suggestion than warranty requirement. I've agreed to go with just the screws, which is a step up from the roofing nails. Correctly installed is the key. I prefer roofing nails to the screws for both walls and floors. Our partners can help you compare quotes from top-rated professionals near you. To make round or curved cuts, use a jigsaw with a carbide blade or a drill and a hole saw bit. Tyler answered your question nothing really bonds to osb. Cement board is used for most floor tile and has all but replaced plywood and drywall backer materials for wall-tile applications in wet areas like showers and tub surrounds. This looked like a pretty helpful group with some knowledgeable guys. 2022 MAPEI Corporation. 2022 The Taunton Press, Inc. All rights reserved. The mortar would serve to prevent any gaps between the layers of the substrate system, improving stability. Installing Cement Board on Walls and Countertops, The Right Way to to Install Cement Board Underlayment for Tile, Best Types of Tile Backer Board for the Shower, Subfloors and Underlayment for Ceramic Tile Floors, Step-by-Step Ceramic Wall Tile Installation, SnapStone Floating Floors vs. So I can't verify this claim. If the product must be embedded in thinset mortar then what is the best mortar for this and can it be the exact same mortar Ill use to set the tiles? Lay the sheets so the joints in the backer board dont line up with the joints in the subfloor. How to Choose Exterior Paint Colors for a Home, How to Finish Drywall Around a Shower Enclosure, Reusable Flood Bags for Fast Bulk-Water Control, Keep Craft Alive Podcast: Ep.18, Kate Hersey and the Minnesota Tool Library, Plus, get an extra 20% off with code GIFT20, 10 Steps to Install Crown Molding on Cabinets, Choosing the Right Construction Tape for the Job, Pretty Good House Book Excerpt: Copper Farmhouse, 10 Dos and Don'ts for Electric In-Floor Heat, Framing Stairs to an Out-of-Level Landing, Good-Looking and Long-Lasting Traditional Gutters, The Fine Homebuilding Interview: William B. x 5-1/4 in. Thanks gents! All Rights Reserved. drywall screws spaced every 6 in. By clicking Accept All Cookies, you agree to the storing of cookies on your device to enhance site navigation, analyze site usage, and assist in our marketing efforts. Leave a 1/4 gap between the backer board and walls and 1/16 gap between the sheets of backer board. Once installed, the backer board will protect wood and plywood subfloors from water damage. You can use regular thinset with a separate latex additive, or a polymer-modified thinset (just add water). 4: The Drywall Guru Offers Expert Advice, Under-Cabinet Lighting Made Easy with EcoSmart Tape Lighting, Ask Danny | Ep. What is "Rosencrantz and Guildenstern" in _The Marvelous Mrs. Maisel_ season 3 episode 5? Mix more thin-set mortar and, using a drywall knife, cover the taped joints with a thin layer, much as you would do when mudding drywall joints. You have to remove the OSB and put down high-rigidity plywood, then a membrane then a cement backer board OR use a wood subfloor with a full mortar bed. What type of molding/cleating should be used? This is a subjective question. Install a layer of 5/8-in. Tape the seams Lay cement board fiberglass mesh tape over all the seams (its sticky on one side). You cannot put tile on OSB because it is not rigid enough. The plywood subfloor should be at least 5/8 thick on 16 centers (3/4 preferred) and securely attached to the joists preferably with screws. Get daily tips and tricks for making your best home. Cut the fiberglass mesh along the backside of the board, as applicable, to complete the cut. The Following User Says Thank You to Snobnd For This Useful Post: Leo, Contractor Talk - Professional Construction and Remodeling Forum. Precut and fit all the cement board and then lift all of the cement boards out. This protects your tile and grout from cracking. Hopefully like Custom or Laticrete the folks that answer the phone have a very good understanding of what occurs in the field. Fasten the sheet with cement board screws, using a drill-driver, making sure the screws are flush with the surface of the sheet or are slightly recessed. If tile were installed over such a base then when someone walked on it and stepped in just the right spot over a hollow thebacker boardwould flex. Announcing the Stacks Editor Beta release! Your subfloor is OSB, so it's questionable whether a mortar bond is wise at all. The best answers are voted up and rise to the top, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site, Learn more about Stack Overflow the company. All rights reserved. Position each piece of backer board in the thin-set, press in place, and attach using special backer board screws on the spacing recommended by the backer board manufacturer. Use only cement board screws and alkali-resistant cement board joint tape. Apply a supporting bed of mortar or modified thinset to subfloor using a 1/4 square-notched trowel. Remove the particleboard and screw the plywood to the floor joists with 1-5/8 in. Well.what exactly is MODIFIED thinset anyways? In my opinion, you'll probably be satisfied with the results if only screws are used. The first step is proper planning and placement. It is for this reason that construction adhesive is even worse than nothing at all. Allow a 1/4-inch gap between the edges of the sheets and all surrounding walls. I'll be putting porcelain chevron tile on top with heated floor wire elements. The backerboard folks specifically specify thinset under their products. You can use it both for the board and the tile. Have them re-do it regardless. This site is protected by reCAPTCHA and the Google. No studs for glass shower door - Can I hollow wall anchor? Only mix as much thin-set as you can use in a half hour and be sure to have solid support under each tile. The adhesive , in its plasticene state, would have to be rigid and hard enough to withstand the force of the screw, an inclined plane, most likely propelled by an impact driver. Cover an area just large enough for the first cement board sheet. Regular Ceramic Tile, Properly Space Your Shelves and Wall Supports, How to Convert an Acrylic or Fiberglass Shower to Tile. It has even been tested. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo, VerticalScope Inc., 111 Peter Street, Suite 600, Toronto, Ontario, M5V 2H1, Canada. Proper installation would be to follow the manufacturers installation instructions for applying cement board to a subfloor. cement board screws spaced every 4 in. Laying cement board is the easiest way to assure a solid, durable base for a ceramic tile floor. drywall screws spaced every 6 in. Ceramic tile laid over cement board is one of the most durable floor or wall surfaces you can install. I think you've misunderstood the question. 1/2-in. i use modified thinset between my hardie and the subfloor all the time. They said as long as I use modified mortar to install the tiles everything should be just fine. I've always used cement screws to hold cement board to plywood; I think the manufacturers recommend them for floor installations. Trying to relate microphone sensitivity and SPL. While I doubt adhesive or mastic would deteriorate the backerboard, if you are going to go to all the trouble of troweling it on, it's just as easy to use thinset. Thinset is going to create a solid surface under tile and prevent flexing that could lead to cracking. Continue installing sheets to cover the entire area. Do the Huichol of Mexico tie rope around the father's testicles during birth? Also it spreads a lot easier than adhesive or mastic. the TSet under the concrete boards is to simply provide support not adhesion. Never use standard screws when installing cement board. Towel Bar in SpotShield Brushed Nickel, Acoustic Armstrong CEILINGS Drop Ceiling Tiles, Woodgrain Millwork WG 1866 0.591 in. Using thinset between the backerboard and subfloor will create additional strength, fill in any potential gaps that exist and lessen the possibility of movement. Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience. Cement board is a good choice for most installations of tileand stone on shower walls, tub walls and floors. Prepare a solid, squeak-free subfloor One of the keys to a long-lasting tile installation is the underlying subfloor. Vinyl flooring glued over 1/4-in. It also means that if your grout did crack and water seeped through, your subfloor would be protected by the cement board. The modal window is a 'site map' of the most critical areas of the site. It's not so much a matter as what's required as it's about what makes a good finished job. For a timeless exterior aesthetic, consider the home, its surroundings, and your personal style. As long as the subfloor is 3/4-in. Backed by his 40-year remodeling career, Danny served as the home improvement expert for CBSs The Early Show and The Weather Channel for more than a decade. What is the gravitational force acting on a massless body? So, I've made a big stink with the flooring guys about how they have installed the Hardiebacker cement board for our tile. To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers. It may have worked out with no ill effects. Lee has over two decades of hands-on experience remodeling, fixing, and improving homes, and has been providing home improvement advice for over 12 years. Will dry-setting the cementboard result in creaks or other noise? We liked this installation video and thought it would be helpful, Bostik Caulks, Sealants & Specialty Products, Schluter Waterproof Substrates & Building Panels, Schluter Waterproofing & Uncoupling Membranes, Bostik Pure Silicone Sealant Portabella H184. Use the same techniques to apply mortar and lay and fasten the remaining sheets in the first row, spacing the sheets 1/4 inch apart and leaving a 1/4-inch gap at all walls. Tool the mortar with the knife so the tape is covered and the joints are flat and smooth. The Home Depot delivers online orders when and where you need them. I no longer use cement board for tile are use Detra! Latex modified thinset is not a bad idea- you could also buy a gallon jug of latex admix, and use your dryset mortar. The cement board is then screwed into the plywood while the thin-set is fresh/wet. Because plywood expands and contracts beneath the ceramic tile, grout and tile failure (loose tiles and cracked, crumbling grout) is just a matter of time. Note: You can download and print Figure A from Additional Information below. I disagree . If you follow all these steps, youll have a stiff, monolithic, crack-free floor. The purpose of the thinset under the backer board is to provide full support under the board. The drying time is important for a strong hold. Can I use unleaded fuel in PA-23 Piper Aztec? Whatever your subfloor is made of, be sure its squeak free before you install the cement board. Waterproofed cement board is an excellent backing for showers and bathtub surrounds. Cut the fiberglass seam tape to length with the thin side of your trowel. What Is Cement Backer Board and How Is It Used? It's just not a good idea to use. 3/4-in. Heres how to prepare the most common subfloor types: 2. MAPEI recommends the use of MAPEI Porcelain Tile Mortar, MAPEI Large-Format Floor & Wall Tile Mortar or MAPEI Large Tile & Stone Mortar in conjunction with mesh tape recommended by the cement board manufacturer. CDX plywood and screw it to the subfloor with 1-5/8 in.